﻿{"id":635,"date":"2010-06-13T14:59:58","date_gmt":"2010-06-13T20:59:58","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/www.mcoupebuyersguide.com\/?p=635"},"modified":"2011-06-14T21:32:06","modified_gmt":"2011-06-15T03:32:06","slug":"whats-with-kbb","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/archive.mcoupebuyersguide.com\/index.php\/2010\/06\/whats-with-kbb\/","title":{"rendered":"What&#8217;s with Kelley Blue Book?"},"content":{"rendered":"<p>If you&#8217;ve been shopping for an M Coupe and need a loan, you were probably very surprised by what the bank told you your dream car was worth. Most banks are now willing to loan 90% of the Kelley Blue Book price for a used car (if you have good credit). The problem is KBB says the car is worth about half of what the market says. Some banks may be willing to look at Edmunds True Market Value or NADA price quotes as well, but they really are not a whole lot better.<\/p>\n<p>These organizations&#8217; price estimates are largely based on a simple  depreciation scale\u00a0 rather than the market and seem to no way factor in  rarity, desirability or collectability. KBB does not even seem to factor in the S54 engine in the later cars. For an example, my personal  dream coupe gets docked for not having a sunroof and for being Steel  Gray. It obviously does not seem to gain anything by being one of two  made in its configuration, a final model year car, having the S54 engine, ridiculously low  miles, etc. A similar M Roadster is actually estimated higher as  convertibles are typically more desirable in the average market, but  that&#8217;s certainly not the case in the M Z3 market.<\/p>\n<p>&#8220;KBB says&#8230;&#8221; is probably the most annoying phrase ever uddered to an M Coupe seller as well. Potential &#8220;buyers&#8221; expecting to buy an M Coupe at KBB value will be sorely disappointed. I don&#8217;t blame those sellers who don&#8217;t even return communication of any interested parties that even mention that phrase. For those reading this, know that this is not a bargaining point. If you are able to find a coupe priced at blue book, buy it and consider yourself lucky as it&#8217;s a rare occurrence by uninformed sellers.<\/p>\n<p>Some coupe owners have talked to Edmunds about their low estimates, but no one really has any solid data to back up what is the market value. That&#8217;s one of the reasons I&#8217;m trying to collect sale prices on M Coupes. Perhaps in the future we can have some more realistic numbers from these organizations.<\/p>\n<p>Here are some examples I ran of similarly optioned, relatively stock coupes (I won&#8217;t even get into modification values) of various years and mileages currently on the market that I think are priced fairly versus their suggested retail value as given by each of the three organizations:<\/p>\n<div style=\"clear: both;\">\n<figure style=\"width: 250px\" class=\"wp-caption alignleft\"><a href=\"http:\/\/archive.mcoupebuyersguide.com\/listings\/listing.aspx?ListingID=1\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" title=\"2002 M Coupe - 7,000 miles\" src=\"http:\/\/www.ceguides.com\/data\/images\/mcoupe\/100_0043_thumb.jpg\" alt=\"2002 M Coupe - 7,000 miles\" width=\"250\" height=\"188\" \/><\/a><figcaption class=\"wp-caption-text\">2002 M Coupe - 7,000 miles<\/figcaption><\/figure>\n<h3>2002 M Coupe<\/h3>\n<p>7,000 miles<br \/>\nCondition: Excellent<br \/>\nPrivate Party<\/p>\n<p><strong>Asking Price: $49,500<\/strong><br \/>\nKelley Blue Book: $16,820 (I wish!)<br \/>\nNADA: $25,025<br \/>\nEdmunds TMV:$22,141<\/p>\n<\/div>\n<div style=\"clear: both;\">\n<figure style=\"width: 250px\" class=\"wp-caption alignleft\"><a href=\"http:\/\/archive.mcoupebuyersguide.com\/listings\/listing.aspx?ListingID=89\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" title=\"2000 M Coupe, 13,505 miles\" src=\"http:\/\/www.ceguides.com\/data\/images\/mcoupe\/00ts-01-front-side3_thumb.jpg\" alt=\"2000 M Coupe, 13,505 miles\" width=\"250\" height=\"166\" \/><\/a><figcaption class=\"wp-caption-text\">2000 M Coupe - 13,505 miles<\/figcaption><\/figure>\n<h3>2000 M Coupe<\/h3>\n<p>13,505 Miles<br \/>\nCondition: Excellent<br \/>\nDealer Retail<\/p>\n<p><strong>Asking Price: $23,800<\/strong><br \/>\nKelley Blue Book: $16,280<br \/>\nNADA: $20,400<br \/>\nEdmunds TMV: $15,186<\/p>\n<\/div>\n<div style=\"clear: both;\">\n<figure style=\"width: 250px\" class=\"wp-caption alignleft\"><a href=\"http:\/\/archive.mcoupebuyersguide.com\/listings\/listing.aspx?ListingID=39\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" title=\"2000 M Coupe - 67,142 miles\" src=\"http:\/\/www.ceguides.com\/data\/images\/mcoupe\/00tseb-01-front-side_thumb.jpg\" alt=\"2000 M Coupe - 67,142 miles\" width=\"250\" height=\"187\" \/><\/a><figcaption class=\"wp-caption-text\">2000 M Coupe - 67,142 miles<\/figcaption><\/figure>\n<h3>2000 M Coupe<\/h3>\n<p>67,142 Miles<br \/>\nCondition: Good<br \/>\nPrivate Party<\/p>\n<p><strong>Asking Price: $17,000<\/strong><br \/>\nKelley Blue Book: $10,880<br \/>\nNADA: $14,325<br \/>\nEdmunds TMV: $11,635<\/p>\n<\/div>\n<div style=\"clear: both;\">\n<figure style=\"width: 250px\" class=\"wp-caption alignleft\"><a href=\"http:\/\/archive.mcoupebuyersguide.com\/listings\/listing.aspx?ListingID=25\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" title=\"1999 M Coupe - 56,980 miles\" src=\"http:\/\/www.ceguides.com\/data\/images\/mcoupe\/99asir-01-front-side_thumb.jpg\" alt=\"1999 M Coupe - 56,980 miles\" width=\"250\" height=\"187\" \/><\/a><figcaption class=\"wp-caption-text\">1999 M Coupe - 56,980 miles<\/figcaption><\/figure>\n<h3>1999 M Coupe<\/h3>\n<p>56,980 Miles<br \/>\nCondition: Excellent<br \/>\nPrivate Party<\/p>\n<p><strong>Asking Price: $19,850<\/strong><br \/>\nKelley Blue Book: $10,710<br \/>\nNADA: $13,800<br \/>\nEdmunds TMV: $10,758<\/p>\n<\/div>\n<div style=\"clear: both;\">\n<figure style=\"width: 250px\" class=\"wp-caption alignleft\"><a href=\"http:\/\/archive.mcoupebuyersguide.com\/listings\/listing.aspx?ListingID=82\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" title=\"1999 M Coupe - 118,000 miles\" src=\"http:\/\/www.ceguides.com\/data\/images\/mcoupe\/99as-01-front-side3_thumb.jpg\" alt=\"1999 M Coupe - 118,000 miles\" width=\"250\" height=\"187\" \/><\/a><figcaption class=\"wp-caption-text\">1999 M Coupe - 118,000 miles<\/figcaption><\/figure>\n<h3>1999 M Coupe<\/h3>\n<p>118,000 Miles<br \/>\nCondition: Good<br \/>\nPrivate Party<\/p>\n<p><strong>Asking Price: $15,900<\/strong><br \/>\nKelley Blue Book: $6,960<br \/>\nNADA: $10,625<br \/>\nEdmunds TMV: $8,020<\/p>\n<\/div>\n<div style=\"clear: both;\">\n<h3>What Can I Do?<\/h3>\n<p>First, consider talking to a credit union. Credit unions have a little more flexibility than banks and may be willing to work a little more with you. Next, go somewhere willing to look at NADA rather than KBB. It is by far the most accurate of these three organizations (although not quite there). Some credit unions will also be willing to look at comps to find a fair price. Because coupes are rare, these are pretty hard to come by. I&#8217;m hoping this site will be helpful with this in the future if I can continue to collect sale prices. Finally, be patient and save up the difference between what you can get for a loan and the price you&#8217;ll have to pay for your dream coupe. Good luck!<\/p>\n<p><a href=\"http:\/\/archive.mcoupebuyersguide.com\/index.php\/2011\/06\/whats-with-kelley-blue-book-part-2\/\">See Part 2 for an update on KBB pricing<\/a><\/p>\n<\/div>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>If you&#8217;ve been shopping for an M Coupe and need a loan, you were probably very surprised by what the bank told you your dream car was worth. Most banks are now willing to loan 90% of the Kelley Blue Book price for a used car (if you have good credit). The problem is KBB says the car is worth about half of what the market says.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":1,"featured_media":0,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[4,5],"tags":[32,31],"class_list":["post-635","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","hentry","category-information","category-lookfor","tag-loans","tag-prices"],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/archive.mcoupebuyersguide.com\/index.php\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/635","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/archive.mcoupebuyersguide.com\/index.php\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/archive.mcoupebuyersguide.com\/index.php\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/archive.mcoupebuyersguide.com\/index.php\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/1"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/archive.mcoupebuyersguide.com\/index.php\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=635"}],"version-history":[{"count":8,"href":"https:\/\/archive.mcoupebuyersguide.com\/index.php\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/635\/revisions"}],"predecessor-version":[{"id":1924,"href":"https:\/\/archive.mcoupebuyersguide.com\/index.php\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/635\/revisions\/1924"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/archive.mcoupebuyersguide.com\/index.php\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=635"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/archive.mcoupebuyersguide.com\/index.php\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=635"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/archive.mcoupebuyersguide.com\/index.php\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=635"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}